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Tiny rabbit may cause jumbo-size headache

By MARK WAITE

The pygmy rabbit is a cute, one-pound, one-foot-long mammal that likes to hang out in tall, dense sagebrush.

But the tiny animal could be the latest addition to the list of creatures covered by the Endangered Species Act in a large swath of Nevada.

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service announced in the Jan. 8, Federal Register, the beginning of a 60-day comment period to list the pygmy rabbit, Brachylagus idahoensis, as threatened or endangered under the 1973 act.

The notice sets in process a review to determine if listing the species is warranted. A rough outline of the habitat for the pygmy rabbit includes much of western Nevada roughly north of Beatty, into central Oregon and Idaho, but excluding much of eastern and southern Nevada. It would include areas like Tonopah.

.....

Pahrump Valley Times

Apparently I haven't been clear enough...

I'm pulling out of this fight..throwin' in the towel :surrender:

I may not like the fees, but I know a little something about damage control.

I just don't have enough details to argue anymore.

All iknow is that I loved going to dumont for FREEEEEEEEEEE!

sorry, forgot to add a at the end of my last post.

(* general post, not a Liberty *)

and I agree I loved it too. I also was fighting the fees as long as I could (together with all the FoDD and big help from Ed Waldheim, CORVA). We gave it a hard fight and at least delayed the fees for two years, but finally we had to give up. The numbers just did not add up. more visitors + more treehuggers + more CBD - OHV funding - BLM funding .... just resulted in fees. The only way to keep Dumont operational.

I also have to give the BLM a . When you look how many people work at the Barstow Field Office and compare the area they have to cover; Dumont, El Mirage, Johnson Valley (biggest OHV area in the USA), Stoddard and Rasor for open OHV areas, many many miles of OHV trails outside the open Areas, but also the Wilderness areas and all the other public lands ... it is amazing how efficient they work (for Government ). Compare that with National Park Service.

Pete,

too bad you did not start earlier with DDR. It would have been great to have this forum behind FoDD five years ago.

When I did FoDD I often felt like , often asked myself why I'm doing this and getting from both sides ... but anytime back out at D I knowed exactly why I did it. My respect goes to current FoDD, the TRT members and you guys (you and ISBB). You all do a great job and thank you all very much for that

Liberty, sorry for the , but you asked for it agreeing with 1320

who pays for the chp? the rangers? the medical? the filght for life ? the water truck? the bathrooms?

chp not BLM (don't know it is still the same, but BLM never paid chp for the plane at big weekends ; BLM; BLM; not BLM; BLM, but again without water truck => no Dumont; bathrooms was not paid by any user fee, green sticker fee or BLM money

Why the ohv permit? What does it accomplish? were does that money go?

there you have your problem. BLM does not get the money. That's partially why we got a fee out at Dumont

Were does the entry fees collected go?

call BLM, they will tell you

Who paid for the sheriffs equipment? sandrails? quads etc?

who pays for your local sheriff ? and his car? there you have your answer

And, were do you think California learned how to be unethical and filled with buercratic red tape? am/pm or the federal level? LOL

don't know what you want to say here

I think its funny that everyone says....they do it for our safety but then its obvious that our safety is way down the line in there things to care about, but you still defend them.

you still not get it. There is no way Dumont can stay open without the things BLM does... and that costs $$$$$$

You can help the BLM making Dumont cheaper. But for that you need to stop complaining and start doing something for Dumont. FoDD is all the time in need of volunteers.

BTW sure I would be nice to have to turn the time back. just ten years ago off weekends was max 3 camps. I miss the sharp razors everywhere, smooth comp, smooth superbowl, no tracks out on the racetrack ...

but get real . the treehuggers would have a field day

BTW, the open mines are on the walking path, that you can not walk into, they go straight down, 100+ feet who knows. The path that is the historial marker path for mining from the 1800's....that hundred of people use every big weekend. Dont tell me you go to dumont and have never ventured outside the sand? They are south - eeast to the dunes, on your way to the small dunes. Yes, I stopped and told a sheriff that was sittng in the flats, in the middle of no where, with nary a soul around (good use of his time) and told him, he already new, they have been like that for years.

There ar about 5 of them....10 ft by 10 ft, with a metal gate, with about 12 inch spacing, and some of those are missing, so you can easily walk right in an fall 100+ feet and die ofcourse.....but I need someone to stop me on the way out to see if I paid to get in?

Was many times there. IMHO plenty enough signs, fenced and clearly outside the OHV area. Don't see why we should pay for it with our fee money that is collected for Dumont OHV area. That would be missuse of our money

And Liberty, you are just wrong comparing TRT with a HOA.

But believe me, I know why ISBB and Pete are making this comments. It is much easier to complain then actually doing something. And the complaining, specially the kind based on wrong assumption, gets old very fast.

But many never asked for it to be PERFECT, we liked it the way IT WAS. Be proactive? in california state government? You are kidding right? How can all this money be collected, and still be a loss? Or rather how was it not ruin in the previous 30-40 50 years of use , with no fees, and virtually no state support? If it was truely a loss, wouldnt it make fiscal sence to pull out and make it just like it was for so many years? How do they determine a loss? Do the count the cost of vehicles? or depreciate them for 5 years or 10 or what? They can pay people to check you on your way out, to see if you paid on your way in, but they cant come up with a few 8 ft steel bars and maybe some wire mesh to cver the open mines in the area? That are state historical sites? Shouldnt the blm area manager be fired? They will pay someone to collect fees but not protect them from death if they fall in a hole? That obviously in any state would result in a multi million dollar settlement from a day one attourney. Thats typical california state government at work, complete and udder failure. Its so messed up , that with out question the only proactive thing to do is over throw the gorvernment and start over. I think a similar thing happened around 225 years ago.

that worked for awhile.

easy answer :

20 years ago :

- nobody cared about dust. Today when there is nothing done to the road, Dumont will be closed soon

- was no Kingston Range Wilderness, nobody cared about use of the existing roads there and the dune extension out to Val Jean

- much less people out there (look how the california high desert and las vegas area have grown=> more people there => more people out in the dunes

- more people => more law enforcement

- BLM got funds from the green sticker program and was federally sound financed. Compare what BLM gets today to run Dumont to what the NPS service gets for a couple hundred hikers at Kelso :eatdrink021:

-etc

but final misconception. BLM is federal. So the fees get not touched by California government ....

You see thats the misconception. The state of california is there to collect revenue, that dont care if they save any lives, or make anyones day better. Sure it might happen, purely by accident, but the reason they are there is to collect money.

That's the misconception right there

I was fighting the fees hard and long (during the time I was heading Friends of Dumont Dunes)

- BLM will still not break even at Dumont

- regulations (and environmental issues) make places like Dumont that expensive

- BLM would have agreed to outsource collection to a group like FoDD. It just did not happen because FoDD never got big enough.

- etc

but rather complaining, why not start to be proactive :

-for example there will be a need to do fences. Think about it, how much will it cost when the government is doing it? compare that to what it would cost when DDR and FoDD would do it :surrender: ... too big of a task ? I don't think so. Friends of El Mirage did it with their area

-or FoDD (or I think even DDR) could try to get a grant for a watertruck.

There would be much more we could do, like second cleanup, maps (with the dirt routes ?!) down to operating BLM equipment and much much more

just my 2 cents

founder and ex pres of FoDD

Basically someone needs to survey all the areas around dumont dunes for lizards. I have a feeling that although they are rare where the heaviest ORV activity occurs, they might be dirt common and in no danger at all just a mile away.

Umaguy,

I think thats exactly the point WE have to make. where most OHV activity occurs is in the big sand hills => no vegitation => No prime habitat for the lizzard.

but look at this picture :

a little difficult to see, but bellow the dark brown mountain are the Val Jean dunes. I made the picture standing on the defunct TT railroad grade looking west. Btw the rr grade is the west border of the OHV area. So all you see in the picture is wilderness area ... and as you can see a lot of OHV traffic there NOT

When you walk into the wilderness you will see hundreds of Lizzards : sandy ground => overgrown => prime habitat for the Lizzard.

To the guys that gave you a hard time ... WE need to show John Q Public the truth and that is not made very well with personal attacs. Umaguy is not our enemy, when you guys want to see and read about our enemy, visit this interesting link

Just to make it clear, I might be a "greenie" but I'm not twisting the truth. For example, I mentioned earlier that the entire study defining the Amargosa river DPS is only based on one gene, a sample size of 1. You could use that as ammunition in your letters to U.S. Fish and Wildlife. Why do I say this? Because it's true. By the way if anyone does some real surveys around the area to prove that these lizards are common, especially in surrounding areas like Ibex Dunes that are off limits to ORVs, then that will instantly shut down the CBD's petition.

good point.... but CBD knows exactly what they are doing.

for example Ibex Dunes is a wilderness area inside Death Valley National Park, so as far as I know BLM can not survey that area.

The Amargosa River distinct population segment of the Mojave fringe-toed lizard only occurs at Dumont Dunes, Coyote Holes, and Ibex Dunes (Death Valley). It is genetically distinct from all other fringe-toed lizards, such as those commonly found at other sites in the southern Mojave. The species in question is a California/Arizona native, not from Africa; the common name "fringe-toed lizard" is also applied to many lizards worldwide which have independently evolved fringed toes to run on fine sand.

I believe it is possible for this isolated lizard population to coexist with ORVs at the Dumont Dunes, but it means that certain dune areas, particularly those that still have vegetation, probably need to be protected. Also, illegal ORV use at Ibex Dunes does not help lizards or riders; it gives authorities more reason to regulate.

Andy,

your post needs some answers and clarifications :

1. Ibex Dunes is not easy to reach from Dumont. Specially with a OHV. Also the road that was used before the (illegal) wilderness area was set up is very difficult to see. When you know where to look you could see that it is not used for a damn long time. I would say when there is a motorvehicle at the Ibex dunes, it is most likely a Death Valley NP visitor in a street legal car...

2. You did not mention the Val Jean Dunes . This dunes are basically the extension of the Dumont Dunes. when you go to Dumont, hook up with a regular and go to the "Northpol". from there look west-southwest and you will see about 10,000 acres of prime living area for this lizards . small dunes with vegetation. This dune area is in another illegal wilderness area; Kingston Range (BTW I say illegal because there are plenty of roads, mines etc etc in that wilderness area and it never should have allowed a wilderness designation)

3. IMHO the whole distinct population talk is big BS. That Lizzies population had no bigger hurdles to go from Dumont/Val Jean to Devils Playground and Kelso then doing the trip from Ibex to Dumont (or the other direction). How does that lizard at Kelso ?

4. like you said the Lizard is California/Arizona native :freakin_nuts:

5. We need to change the bogus ESA. ESA was a good idea going very very damn bad and currently only used to fill the pockets of the "environmental industry". $$$$$ The "environmental industry" does not care about the little bugs and animals. $$$$$

Thomas

ex President of Friends of Dumont Dunes

on edit :

Google sat picture Ibex dunes

Google map sat picture Val Jean Dunes

I just PayPal'd as a Business Member. I would have done more. The site should promote contributions via payPal and leave the amount open.

You can

go to friendsofdumontdunes.org

left side there is an donation botton , no question asked, nothing to fill out :headbang: (except what paypal is asking you)

or

you can send a check to :

Friends of Dumont Dunes

20708 Nashville Street

Chatsworth, CA 91311

please make check payable to "Friends of Dumont Dunes"

this way paypal does not get their part of the money :rainbow1:

BTW V8Rail is also proud FoDD business member