thanks man!!! frm wat ive heard they have plenty of power for the dunes and pretty much everything u throw at them. i rode in one of the 800cc buggys at pismo and mojave and it did pretty good. i like yoshis rail better to but its outa my pricerange . i would use it on hardpacked to in the moutains and mojave also . i appreciate your suggestions everybody and please keep em coming. also i heard that every joyner is now fully inspected and tested before it is sold. and yes they should bring back the oddesy :freakin_nuts: