wingnut Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAGDOLL MX Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 effin craig.... TTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltr450rider Posted December 16, 2007 Share Posted December 16, 2007 OK. So I watch Mythbusters today. There's a post on here somewhere that said they were supposed to cover this topic today. NOTHING It was all about if an average person can land a commercial airliner without a trained pilot and a bunch of Point Break the movie myths. Like how long does it take to freefall from 4000', can you catch a person in midair by streamlining yourself, and if can you have a conversation while freefalling. Oh well. Some other day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAlaskan Posted December 16, 2007 Share Posted December 16, 2007 I just read this entire thread from page 1 to 4 and its pretty interesting. I agree that yes the plane will take off. If i understand basic jet engine technology ( which I probably don't) The turbine sucks the air into the engine which then compressess it, adds fuel, ignites it and forces it out the back. So the plane is essentially getting sucked through the air. The only thing the conveyor is going to do is constantly increase the forward speed of the wheels which have nothing to do with the forward movement of the plane besides reduce friction. But the more I think about it the bigger my headache gets....I think it all boils down to whether the conveyor is moving at the speed of the wheels, or the speed of the plane itself Ahhh well, the dancing tweaker video was worth it I need a beer now, i feel like my brains were just :chug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAGDOLL MX Posted December 16, 2007 Share Posted December 16, 2007 Then there would have to many many others closed if we start moderating by that rule. Just leave it be. It will die one day. well Deven (vegasHD) and Dan (dnchevyman) and i have been arguing over this over and over....my wife thinks iam nuts but i have my own opinion i will give a breif over view: MATCHING TREDMILL SPEED and matching Prop speed the plane will not take off...the prop only creates the Pull necessary to make a plane go foward, when the plane moves foward enough to create the lift necessary to take flight that is when it will fly... thats my opinion....now ask those two knuckleheads what they think....and your hear all kinds of silly thoughts! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeDuner Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 It will definately take off !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGP Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 (edited) it will take off. Drop a feather from the sky, as its falling, shoot it with a stream of compressed air. Does it move forward? Yes. Does it matter whats below it? No. This is the same theory of a jet. Compressed air pushing an object forward. Has nothing to do with whats under it. Another example, Put a rubber band on the front of a hotwheel car. Place the hotwheel on a treadmill. Pull the car all the way back to stretch the rubber band. Now turn the treadmill on AS FAST AS YOU WANT. SPEED DOESNT MATTER BECAUSE THERE IS NO FRICTION. Now let go of the hotwheel. Does it go forward? Yes. This is the same thing as a prop on a regular airplane. It pulls the airplane just like a rubber band will pull the hotwheel. iF THE WHEELS DROVE THE AIRPLANE/VEHICLE IT WOULD NOT FLY, But since it is driven by a difference in air pressure the wheels are totally out of the equation. So again YES it will fly. Edited December 17, 2007 by ORIGINALPIMP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KawasakiBob Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 I shoved my pinky finger so far up my nose that I poked my brain and my left leg started kickin all wildlike. Sweet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerhouse Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 well Deven (vegasHD) and Dan (dnchevyman) and i have been arguing over this over and over....my wife thinks iam nuts but i have my own opinion i will give a breif over view: MATCHING TREDMILL SPEED and matching Prop speed the plane will not take off...the prop only creates the Pull necessary to make a plane go foward, when the plane moves foward enough to create the lift necessary to take flight that is when it will fly... thats my opinion....now ask those two knuckleheads what they think....and your hear all kinds of silly thoughts! thank you Cole !! the plane has to have speed to get wind for the lift !! what arn't you guys catching here ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 This just in, the plane ran out of fuel, so it can't take off. . Seriously, I asked a flight crew at work and they said the plane would take off. I figured they would be a reliable source since they fly for a living!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertskyz Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 PALEEAAASSSSEEEE! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunefreak Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 thank you Cole !! the plane has to have speed to get wind for the lift !! what arn't you guys catching here ?? no chit! And that speed is achieved by the jet freakin engines! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerhouse Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 This just in, the plane ran out of fuel, so it can't take off. . Seriously, I asked a flight crew at work and they said the plane would take off. I figured they would be a reliable source since they fly for a living!! why don't you deliver my package ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGP Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 Its just funny how people cannot get over the fact that the WHEELS on an airplane have NOTHING TO do with how it propels itself forward. Hell most fullsize jets use airbrakes to slow them down and stop them. So if an airplane lands say at 190 mph. And it lands on a treadmill going 190 mph the opposite direction does it stop moving forward when it lands? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAGDOLL MX Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 (edited) i know that the wheels have nothing to do with it. prop or jet powered...either way...if it is moving at the EXACT same speed...then it will most likely not move foward, now will it take off. if treadmill speed is 75mph, and the prop/jet speed is 95mph, then it will essentially be going 20mph....not having the speed necessary to "CREATE" lift the plane will not take flight. and this dosent even include the resistance of the wheels/tires on the treadmill, nor does it include the resistance of the wheel bearings and anything else that would create drag on the aircraft. AS MIMINAL as it may be with the resistance it still matters. but we are not including these in this equation. with a take off speed of 70 mph, the treadmill at 70 mph, the plane will not take flight, at a speed of 140mph for take off speed of 70mph and a treadmill at 70mph, there is a possibility of flight..... Edited December 17, 2007 by RAGDOLL MX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunefreak Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 i know that the wheels have nothing to do with it. prop or jet powered...either way...if it is moving at the EXACT same speed...then it will most likely not move foward, now will it take off. if treadmill speed is 75mph, and the prop/jet speed is 95mph, then it will essentially be going 20mph....not having the speed necessary to "CREATE" lift the plane will not take flight. Cole I think your head is up your :dance: . Seriously though. If the prop is spinning fast enough to create 95 mph of force, then it will propel the plane at 95 mph in relation to the ground, not the stupid treadmill. The prop is not driving the wheels. The plane wouldn't be moving at the same speed as the treadmill. Quit thinking like that. I can't believe I am even still posting in this dumb azz thread. fk it, I'm going back to posting "I LIKE PIZZA!" instead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicoleinVegas Posted December 17, 2007 Author Share Posted December 17, 2007 I can't believe it popped back up AGAIN! Someone now said they will air the show at the end of January. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGP Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 (edited) Im looking forward to seeing this on mythbusters. Edited December 17, 2007 by ORIGINALPIMP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerhouse Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 [ Home Page | Message Boards | News | Archive | Ask Cecil | Books | Buy Stuff | FAQs, etc. ] [ Previous Week | Recent Columns Index ] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- An airplane taxies in one direction on a moving conveyor belt going the opposite direction. Can the plane take off? 03-Feb-2006 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dear Cecil: Please, please, please settle this question. The discussion has been going on for ages, and any time someone mentions the words "airplane" or "conveyor belt" everyone starts right back up. Here's the original problem essentially as it was posed to us: "A plane is standing on a runway that can move (some sort of band conveyer). The plane moves in one direction, while the conveyer moves in the opposite direction. This conveyer has a control system that tracks the plane speed and tunes the speed of the conveyer to be exactly the same (but in the opposite direction). Can the plane take off?" There are some difficulties with the wording of the problem, specifically regarding how we define speed, but the spirit of the situation is clear. The solution is also clear to me (and many others), but a staunch group of unbelievers won't accept it. My conclusion is that the plane does take off. Planes, whether jet or propeller, work by pulling themselves through the air. The rotation of their tires results from this forward movement, and has no bearing on the behavior of a plane during takeoff. I claim the only difference between a regular plane and one on a conveyor belt is that the conveyor belt plane's wheels will spin twice as fast during takeoff. Please, Cecil, show us that it's not only theoretically possible (with frictionless wheels) but it's actually possible too. --Berj A. Doudian, via e-mail Cecil replies: Excuse me--did I hear somebody say Monty Hall? On first encounter this question, which has been showing up all over the Net, seems inane because the answer seems so obvious. However, as with the infamous Monty-Hall-three-doors-and-one-prize-problem (see The Straight Dope: "On Let's Make a Deal" you pick Door #1, 02-Nov-1990), the obvious answer is wrong, and you, Berj, are right--the plane takes off normally, with no need to specify frictionless wheels or any other such foolishness. You're also right that the question is often worded badly, leading to confusion, arguments, etc. In short, we've got a topic screaming for the Straight Dope. First the obvious-but-wrong answer. The unwary tend to reason by analogy to a car on a conveyor belt--if the conveyor moves backward at the same rate that the car's wheels rotate forward, the net result is that the car remains stationary. An aircraft in the same situation, they figure, would stay planted on the ground, since there'd be no air rushing over the wings to give it lift. But of course cars and planes don't work the same way. A car's wheels are its means of propulsion--they push the road backwards (relatively speaking), and the car moves forward. In contrast, a plane's wheels aren't motorized; their purpose is to reduce friction during takeoff (and add it, by braking, when landing). What gets a plane moving are its propellers or jet turbines, which shove the air backward and thereby impel the plane forward. What the wheels, conveyor belt, etc, are up to is largely irrelevant. Let me repeat: Once the pilot fires up the engines, the plane moves forward at pretty much the usual speed relative to the ground--and more importantly the air--regardless of how fast the conveyor belt is moving backward. This generates lift on the wings, and the plane takes off. All the conveyor belt does is, as you correctly conclude, make the plane's wheels spin madly I WAS WRONG !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SandBox_Kid Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Cole I think your head is up your . Seriously though. If the prop is spinning fast enough to create 95 mph of force, then it will propel the plane at 95 mph in relation to the ground, not the stupid treadmill. The prop is not driving the wheels. The plane wouldn't be moving at the same speed as the treadmill. Quit thinking like that. I can't believe I am even still posting in this dumb azz thread. fk it, I'm going back to posting "I LIKE PIZZA!" instead :dance: Don't feel that you efforts were in vain.....the light actually went on for me when you stated: The prop is not driving the wheels. It's amazing....I'm trusted with millions of $$ in Govt info, and I couldn't understand what you guys were trying to say all this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGP Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Don't feel that you efforts were in vain.....the light actually went on for me when you stated: It's amazing....I'm trusted with millions of $$ in Govt info, and I couldn't understand what you guys were trying to say all this time. I STILL WANT TO SEE IT ON MYTHBUSTERS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerhouse Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I STILL WANT TO SEE IT ON MYTHBUSTERS. Me Too !! I still don't want it to fly !! hahaha Jan 30 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltr450rider Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I'll believe it when I see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAGDOLL MX Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 cmoooonnnnn mythbusters!~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas style Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 i hate being wrong but i am i give in damn it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.